Banking on KC – Whitney VinZant of VinZant Restaurants & VinZant Wines
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Kelly Scanlon:
Welcome to Banking on KC. I'm your host, Kelly Scanlon. Thank you for joining us. With us on this episode is serial entrepreneur, Whitney VinZant, the founder of Louie's Wine Dive and President of VinZant Restaurants and VinZant Wines. Welcome, Whit.
Whitney VinZant:
Welcome. Thanks for having me.
Kelly Scanlon:
So many things to cover here. I always knew about Louie's Wine Dive, but I did not know about these other endeavors that you have. But let's start with Louie's Wine Dive because a lot of people here in Kansas City especially know it. It's familiar to them. Tell us about its roots.
Whitney VinZant:
The roots of Louie's Wine Dive go back much further than the concept itself. I started in restaurants in high school. Through college at Wake Forest I worked in restaurants as well. And following graduation, initially began my restaurant career with franchises.
Kelly Scanlon:
Any that we would recognize?
Whitney VinZant:
We developed old Chicago restaurants, learned a great deal from those franchises and they were successful. But as time went by, both myself and our company began really wanting to do our own restaurants. Just had that inspiration, I think, a passion for product. We went back to one of the products we loved, which was wine, and saw an opportunity for a restaurant that was neighborhood oriented, selling good food, good and fresh wines, different varietals that people don't see every day at a value that. Led into Louie's Wine dive. I think the concept itself continues to get stronger and stronger. I think the reason for that is really the team. At this point, first, Louie's Wine Dive in Des Moines, Iowa, near 15 years old. We have locations in Clayton, in St. Louis, and also in Overland Park. Each acts differently, but a similarity between them is the teams are really good.
Kelly Scanlon:
Yeah, I mean, I've been into them, and uniformly, the team members are familiar with your wines, can make good suggestions, knowledgeable suggestions, and service is always great.
Whitney VinZant:
Well, thank you. I appreciate that. To that end, we do a great deal of training. We have many certified somms within Louie's Wine Dive. They're passionate about it, and I'm always really happy to see what it does show.
Kelly Scanlon:
You've also acquired, if I remember right, Taco Republic, BRGR, Gram and Dun. I mean, the list is pretty lengthy these days. You were talking about your team. When you are spread out across so many different brands and geographic locations, how do you keep a culture intact? When I go into Des Moines, versus St. Louis, versus Kansas City, or BRGR versus a Gram, and Dun, versus a Louie's Wine Dive, how do you keep that culture consistent across all those variables?
Whitney VinZant:
That is challenging. That goes across, I think many businesses, many industries. Within restaurants the culture and the values of those teams is the determining factor as to how successful that restaurant's going to be. Oftentimes, we get caught up in how restaurants look, the brick, the mortar.
Kelly Scanlon:
Right. The kind of pictures on the walls.
Whitney VinZant:
Exactly. There's a lot of different factors that can come into it. But at the end of the day, I think people can feel when you're genuine, they can feel when things are operating the right way. The way that we continue that in Des Moines and St. Louis, Pittsburgh, some of these other markets, is first and foremost, that's where we start our discussions, and that's where we end our discussions too. We talk about operational sets and product and all these things that certainly have a huge effect on ultimately the dining experience we deliver, but the philosophy behind some very simple things, doing good to your neighbor, treating them as you want to be treated, that's the important stuff. We oftentimes talk about how our leaders have to showcase that. Ultimately, at some point within a restaurant, the team and the values of the restaurant should reflect upon the individual, not just in the restaurant, but also outside of it.
Kelly Scanlon:
You have all these different brands. Many of them have come through acquisition. So when you are trying to acquire another company, another brand, what is it that you look for in it?
Whitney VinZant:
Team first, product right behind that. Does it provide a compelling experience for its guests? Is there a durable, competitive advantage with what they're doing? As a report card, the financials tend to say the same thing. So superior unit economics are something we look for as well.
Kelly Scanlon:
Yeah. So besides the financials, what is distinguishing it from your competition out there?
Whitney VinZant:
You look at loyalty. You look at how strong the brand is. As you get into further details, look at location, is it a location that's going to generate success in the future? But ultimately, the brand, the product, the team, the coalesce, and within that, we want to be involved with brands that have the ability to achieve enduring success. So that's the first step. The second step, can we add value?
Kelly Scanlon:
You don't want to just maintain the status quo, you want to take it to the next level?
Whitney VinZant:
We do. Now we have to define a lot of these brands. Waldo Pizza, for example, a recent acquisition, December 9th last year. If I change the pizza, I'm going to be killed. I'm going to be thrown out of town.
Kelly Scanlon:
They're going to run you out. Exactly.
Whitney VinZant:
So you have your bedrock that you absolutely maintain and keep to the same quality standard. But is there a way that we can look at the leasehold or the property, the building itself, and make it more unique and desirable for guests? I think certainly, with our breadth of knowledge with product, food and beverage, there's a lot of local purveyors that we work with, and they produce superior product than purchasing that through other means. I'd also say as a restaurateur and our team that's been in this business and learned a lot of different things, can we define that dining experience in a way that is more satisfying to our guests? For example, you mentioned wine. How do we pair that with some of the food at Waldo Pizza, and what can we do to make that unique? So those are the things that... It gets to be really fun.
Kelly Scanlon:
People don't necessarily go into a pizza restaurant expecting to get a really nice glass of wine.
Whitney VinZant:
Absolutely.
Kelly Scanlon:
So if you can create that kind of experience, well, that's all the better. You've expanded into a variety of different cities, as we've established. You're out in California too, with the winery. Why do you keep Kansas City as your headquarters?
Whitney VinZant:
It's home. I love Kansas City. It wasn't always my home. I moved here 14, 15 years ago.
Kelly Scanlon:
So you're still relatively new?
Whitney VinZant:
Yes. Yes, I guess.
Kelly Scanlon:
Where did you move from?
Whitney VinZant:
Kentucky.
Kelly Scanlon:
Okay.
Whitney VinZant:
Yeah, where I met my wife, Emily, and we've had four children here.
Kelly Scanlon:
Oh, wow.
Whitney VinZant:
We don't intend to have anymore. But Kansas City quickly became home for us. It's the people, the attractions the city has. It's wonderful also to raise children here.
Kelly Scanlon:
So in many ways, the city emulates what you're trying to achieve with your brand?
Whitney VinZant:
I think so.
Kelly Scanlon:
[inaudible 00:07:36] focus on the people. You mentioned that first.
Whitney VinZant:
I think so. Yeah.
Kelly Scanlon:
Yeah. So you talked about some of the different things that you look for in your acquisitions, and I think everybody's pretty familiar with the fact that the restaurant business is not an easy one. It's fraught with lots of things. I mean, every business is, but especially with restaurants, margins are typically low. You have to deal with constant employee turnover. It's a challenge. And then you have something like the COVID pandemic. I mean, maybe it's only a once-in-one hundred-year thing, but it's still a thing when it happens. So those are just a few that come to mind. That's not even talking about the shifts in consumer tastes, their expectation, the different dining concepts that you're constantly having to compete against. So tell us about how it's changed during your time in the industry, nearly two decades now, and how have you managed to grow in spite of those challenges? I know that the culture is huge, but talk about how you've managed to become not just a success with the one, but successful enough to be able to start acquiring and to move into other areas.
Whitney VinZant:
Looking back on it, when we determined to take a step towards being more entrepreneurial, doing our own restaurants, we had to learn a lot with that. Along that path, we made so many different mistakes. I mean, I look back on it in certain menu items we introduced, just crazy. But that's how you learn.
Kelly Scanlon:
Sure, sure.
Whitney VinZant:
You don't know how far you can push it till you push it too far. You have to learn that along the way. I think authenticity and genuine product, those are two elements I think our general guests have become much more astute in seeing. In general, full service restaurants where you're enjoying the atmosphere and your company for a little bit longer, they certainly feel whether or not this food was made from scratch, whether or not this wine is satisfying or these cocktails or beer. That's something that we can distinguish ourselves from more of the chain national competition, which that comes with its own set of ideas.
Kelly Scanlon:
So what are some of the trends that you have seen over the two decades that you think have stuck that are here to stay, and then some of the ideas that were flash in the pan that people glommed on to it and turned out people aren't really excited about that?
Whitney VinZant:
Yeah. More complex consumers in general.
Kelly Scanlon:
Yes. A little more savvy?
Whitney VinZant:
Much more. When we started Louie's Wine Dive, our competition, from a wine standpoint... Not all of them, but the vast majority of restaurants were serving the same brands, by the glass.
Kelly Scanlon:
You still see that to a certain extent.
Whitney VinZant:
You still do. But now you can go to so many restaurants and try such selections, and the same is true with food. So I think that you're seeing more and more adventurous dining. When I first started 2005, 2006, with our own restaurants, the foodie concept just wasn't then what it is now.
Kelly Scanlon:
Yeah. There's a willingness to try new items.
Whitney VinZant:
There is. And I think we see that in very real ways too. Last year I formalized an agreement with Theresa and Richard Ng of Bo Lings. In doing that, we had many discussions. They've been in the business 41 years, maybe 42 years now. They've seen huge changes. And the way that that entire friendship came about was, I met them at a wedding. Restaurateurs oftentimes have a comradery, and we were able to get together following that. And we really began having these dinner dates where he would do something, a Szechuan dish, for example, that I'd never even heard of or imagined. And then I had to try to compensate on my side, which became quite challenging pretty quick. But one thing that I asked Richard along the way, I said, "There are all these really complex dishes that you're making. I just love some of these. A steamed turbo made in a soy, ginger, orange sauce. Why aren't these on your menu?" And he said, "Well, during the eighties, during the nineties, this isn't how our guests wanted to use us."
Kelly Scanlon:
And now people actually come to a restaurant knowing that the menu's not going to be the same from month to month, or there's this seasonal concepts and so forth.
Whitney VinZant:
So every fall we take our chefs on different inspirational trips. And we were at Gramercy Tavern in New York this year. Chef Michael Anthony, he commented how far specifically the Midwest had progressed with its food. The food scene in Kansas City speaks for itself.
Kelly Scanlon:
You are a cereal entrepreneur. We've talked a little bit about VinZant Wines, and that's in California's Sonoma Valley. What inspired that move?
Whitney VinZant:
A passion for wine. Passion for product, first. But I really have enjoyed wine in a lot of different scenarios, and it's been a large part of my career.
Kelly Scanlon:
I was going to ask you, did that love of wine and appreciation for it start because of your exposure in the restaurant business, or what did it precede that?
Whitney VinZant:
No, it was absolutely the restaurant business, and largely, Louie's Wine Dive, in many ways. The concept of the vineyard and the growing of product, it just really called to me. It was something that I had wanted to do for 11, 12 years, and I was entirely unsuccessful with getting it started for eight of those seven and a half.
Kelly Scanlon:
Were you trying or just you were too busy?
Whitney VinZant:
I was actively involved. During that time we figured out a lot and learned a lot. Along the way we obtained representation to try to find us the right vineyard that had this specific criteria. And that doesn't happen every day.
Kelly Scanlon:
No, it doesn't. Well, and the wine industry is very complex. As somebody sitting there drinking their glass of wine, at its very heart, it's agricultural. You talk about the vineyard. You were so choosy or picky about what vineyard it was going to be because that's so important. The terroir and everything else that goes with that. You've got the art and science of wine making on top of the agricultural. And then of course, you've got sales, you've got delivery and all of the business aspects of it. So how do you manage all those things?
Whitney VinZant:
They grow together. One thing I've seen even in California is a lot of the growers and the winemakers are not constantly in touch with the people who are drinking their wine. So when we look at what varietals sell, what price points within those varietals sell, I've been doing that for 20 years.
Kelly Scanlon:
Well, that's where the restaurant industry serves you well, being in tune with your customers, going out on the floor and saying hello to them.
Whitney VinZant:
That's reinforced on a daily basis. That's a huge advantage going into that. So we could reverse a lot of these decisions. The production side has been the most challenging for us. We are fortunate to have a wonderful wine maker. Adam Lee and Murray Braylon both are working on our wines. I had longstanding twenty-year relationships with them. We also have a wonderful vineyard manager who works on our wine, and that's really where the wine is created. In fact, when you see the labels, you'll see photographs of the vineyard. We work 90% of our times in the vineyard.
Kelly Scanlon:
In addition to being in tune with your customers, you are in tune with the land itself and with the vineyard, with your crop. Because you've mentioned you like to spend as much time as you can out there with your vineyard manager and your team there.
Whitney VinZant:
Yes. 19 flights in the last 12 months.
Kelly Scanlon:
19?
Whitney VinZant:
19. Sacramento or Oakland or STS. I know them well.
Kelly Scanlon:
And you are talking about airline flights, not wine flights?
Whitney VinZant:
No, no, no. Yeah. I'm involved all the way from pruning through... I'm a licensed chemical applicator now.
Kelly Scanlon:
Oh, you are?
Whitney VinZant:
Yes. Through all the farming and harvest. Really enjoy all parts of it. Right now, we're making some big decisions out there specific to certain clones of Cabernet that we're planting. So we're getting quite detailed in what we're doing.
Kelly Scanlon:
Your vineyard, if I remember right, is fairly high up the side of a mountain, isn't it? It's not in the valley. So the Cabernet would grow very well.
Whitney VinZant:
Correct. We wanted mountainside vineyard, and I think it has an elevation change of 700 feet. So we have certain slopes within the vineyard up to 38 degrees.
Kelly Scanlon:
The different microclimates. Yep.
Whitney VinZant:
Tremendous. The terroir, it's all volcanic stone within that range, so it's very challenging to farm. Everything's done by hand. For example, we planted 3.1 acres last year, and out of the vines that we planted, over half of them we had to hammer drill the stone out to put soil in those holes so that the vines had something to hold onto to begin their growth.
Kelly Scanlon:
But that actually makes the wine even better because when they struggle to grow like that... It doesn't seem logical, but it really is. The wines are so much more beautiful.
Whitney VinZant:
It gives them a sense of place.
Kelly Scanlon:
What is your favorite varietal? What do you like to drink?
Whitney VinZant:
Ooh. I haven't met too many I dislike. It really just depends on the setting. It depends on what we're eating. Starting with champagne and chardonnay and pinot noir, all the way through cabernet and red blends. There's so much good wine out there that needs to be experienced today. If I had one recommendation towards doing that, specifically for people new to it or maybe don't understand a lot about it, stick with a varietal or stick within Appalachian. Stick with a place and get to understand that before you move on to a bunch of different wines, because that becomes quite confusing really fast.
Kelly Scanlon:
What's next for your businesses?
Whitney VinZant:
Next for the businesses? Well, our teams want to grow some of our restaurants, so that is high on my priority list. I have no interest in growing for growth's sake. I want to grow restaurants that we can take a great deal of pride in and make unique and wonderful for its guests. So that authenticity, that really is important to us. And I would say that that may be a good example for how our wine side of the business is affecting our restaurant side of the business. They complement each other, and in some ways, I think it's made us better across the board. So I think we're hyper focused on the team and the quality that the teams can create.
Kelly Scanlon:
Well, and it's showing. Thank you so much for coming on the show and talking about your story and about where you're going and what's made you successful. As you said, some of this applies to so many other businesses as well. So we appreciate those insights.
Whitney VinZant:
Thanks, Kelly.
Joe Close:
This is Joe Close, President of Country Club Bank. Thank you to Whitney VinZant for being our guest on this episode of Banking on KC. From founding Louie's Wine Dive to expanding his business portfolio with multiple brands, Whit's entrepreneurial journey reflects a passion for hospitality, a commitment to team culture, and a dedication to quality. His vision has fueled the success of his businesses and also enriched Kansas City's diverse dining scene. At Country Club Bank we value the connections that make Kansas City a stronger, more vibrant place to live and work. And we are proud to support the entrepreneurs who helped create those meaningful experiences. Thanks for tuning in this week. We're banking on you, Kansas City. Country Club Bank, member FDIC.