Banking on KC – Dr. Carmaletta Williams of the Black Archives of Mid-American
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Kelly Scanlon:
Welcome to Banking on KC. I'm your host, Kelly Scanlon. Thank you for joining us. With us on this episode is Dr. Carmaletta Williams, the CEO at Black Archives of Mid-America in Kansas City. The Black Archives is also celebrating its 50th anniversary this year. Welcome, Dr. Carma.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Thank you for inviting me.
Kelly Scanlon:
Well, I'm so happy to have you here and it's good to have you back with us on this podcast right now, especially it's Black History Month and you have a huge celebration coming up for your 50th anniversary, so congratulations on that big milestone. With that in mind, take us back to the organization's founding. What was the inspiration behind it?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Our founder, Horace M. Peterson III started collecting buttons and brochures when he was in middle school and he was telling all his friends that he was going to open a Black museum and they were really skeptical and discouraging. You're not going to make any money doing that. Why would you want to do that? But he stayed focused on that and that's what he wanted to do.
Kelly Scanlon:
What time period was this?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Well, 50, 60 years ago. It was 50 years from the establishment in 1974, but he started this out years before that, and so then he had jobs, but he continued to collect and he would store the documents and the artifacts in the trunk of his car.
His mother ran a secondhand store, and so he learned a lot about salvaging and how to keep things from her. He also went to the Smithsonian and learned about archiving so that he was doing it right.
So this location where we are now, its 1722 17th Terrace. I count as the fifth space for the Black Archives. The trunk of his car was the very first, then he was able to get a room at the 18th and Paseo YMCA. When that building became uninhabitable, he rented an apartment and then when they desegregated the firehouses, he was able to get Firehouse Number 11, which was the Black Firehouse of 2022 Vine. Unfortunately, Mr. Peterson didn't live long enough to see the archives in the building where it's housed now. It's a big, beautiful building, and that's the fifth location.
Kelly Scanlon:
It has evolved to become a really integral part of Kansas City's cultural landscape. Talk to us a little bit about that evolution.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Well, it's important that people understand a true and honest history of Black Kansas City, and the archives fills in that lacuna with the documents that Mr. Peterson collected, and he's known for dumpster diving behind the Call Paper and at other places to pull out important documents that would end up in a landfill. And then people in our community are constantly bringing us documents, pictures, artifacts that they think are essential to defining Kansas City. So we have literally, literally thousands and thousands and thousands of pictures, documents and artifacts. We can't put them all out on display at the same time.
So we have the permanent exhibition hall, the Ewing, Marion Kaufman Exhibition Hall, and then we have a rotating gallery that we try to exchange the exhibits in there every month to six weeks. We have the Women's Basketball, Professional Basketball Hall of Fame, which is being expanded as we speak. We also have Heritage Hall, a recording studio and other spaces.
In the hallway upstairs we will be honoring the late HW Sewing a banker, the first black bank in the Kansas City areas in Kansas City, Kansas with a mural that someone had created for him and that hung in the bank. So the whole building is an act of breathing exhibit.
Kelly Scanlon:
It certainly is, and with the community bringing you things, it is really a living, breathing museum. Not sometimes the word archives can seem like things that are filed away, but this is actually a living, breathing place.
Now talking about your 50th anniversary, what are you going to do to celebrate? Tell us about those.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
We are going to have a gala. Usually every year we've had a luncheon, but because it's the 50th, we wanted to make it extremely special. So we will be at the Downtown Convention Center in the K Barnes suite celebrating the 50th anniversary. We will have speakers come. Our theme is No Revisionist History, tell the truth. And so Michael Harriott, who is a television commentator, he's on M-S-N-B-C and CNBC, and also a published author and educator will be our keynote speaker.
So we're going to talk about the truth telling in history. We're going to celebrate the honesty of the people in Kansas City who have said, "If you want to know the truth, here are the documents, here's the evidence, here are the pictures," and we're going to celebrate the lives of those people. Not one person or one organization represents all of especially Black Kansas City. So this is a celebration and an honor of all of it.
Kelly Scanlon:
And that's coming up really quickly. Tell us about the dates and how we might get tickets and other things that we might be interested in knowing about this celebration.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Yeah the celebration is February 17th, which also happens to be my birthday-
Kelly Scanlon:
Well, Happy Birthday.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
... but we didn't schedule that so that all of those people would come to celebrate with me. But it's February 17th and it'll be at the Downtown Convention Center. You can get tickets by going to our website, www.blackarchives.org. And the first thing that'll pop up as the anniversary gala tab. And you can go in, you can be a sponsor, we hope, or you can order individual seats, or you can come into the archives, 1722 17th Terrace and reserve your space.
Kelly Scanlon:
Reflecting on that 50th anniversary, what are some of the key achievements that you're particularly proud of? I know that you took us through the history there, but from your perspective, what are you especially proud of?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
We know that young people have been on phones and computers since before they went to kindergarten. So one of the things that I am especially proud of is our move. It's not filled. We have a long way to go to make it interactive. We had 16,000 visitors last year. Many of those were children and they were all very polite. They all went through and they looked and they told us what a great time they had, but I know they were bored. So we've been very fortunate to get some grants to buy kiosk, and we've been filming, one series is called The Village, where ordinary people talk about historical facts. We also have received a grant from the 400 years of African-American History Commission, and our young people partnered with Rodney Thompson and Stinson McClendon, and we made a beautiful film, it's called An Inconceivable Journey, and it covers the history of black folk from Africa almost up until today.
So I'm really, really proud of the way that we've included our young people into building this. They tell us what works for them, and they're really active in sharing their art with us and their crafts with us to build it and to refurbish it and to bring the Black archives up into this century.
Kelly Scanlon:
And so often you can learn about things in school and even then if they're taught, they don't come alive the way they can when they come and experience what you're talking about. And so that makes a bigger impression.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
And if it's taught is probably the most important phrase that we've said since we've been here. I taught African American studies for 30 years on the college level. Every single semester a student would say, "Why didn't we learn this in high school?" Or,"Why didn't I learn this in grade school?" And it's just hasn't been taught. So it's a complete story that we're trying to tell and an honest story. So thank you for saying that because that is an extremely important part.
We've partnered with Equal Justice Initiative, the Brian Stevenson and the Just Mercy folk in Alabama. We have the only exhibition outside of Montgomery, Alabama that's dedicated to people of racial murder. Also, our founder, Horace Peterson, discovered that there was a home where a formerly enslaved woman lived. The family said, "Yeah, you can have it." So we have Lucy's cabin there. Every board is from that cabin. Every artifact is from there. It's a third, the original size. It had been there since the days of enslavement, and a lot of the boards were rotted, but it's original and they can see, and I love the questions, young people want to know where did she sleep? And then I get to talk about innerspring mattresses are a fairly new phenomenon, and people didn't have those kinds of beds, and we talked about enslaved people having communities and marriages and births and religious services and parties. They don't read about that. They don't learn that. So we're trying to tell and show a complete picture.
Kelly Scanlon:
Yeah, and in so many ways, the genealogy lab that you have so much more important because you say there were marriages and there were families, but then they would get broken up by being sold. And so sometimes it's very hard to trace the genealogy. Would that be correct?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
That's absolutely right, and people are often frustrated, but we have to tell them the truth. And the truth is you have to often look at functional families because we know that a real threat during the days of enslavement was to being sold down the river.
We know in Kentucky and Tennessee, there were the only two states where there were multiple generations of people born on the same plantations. That didn't happen for most folk. So we have to understand that the person who took care of you and raised you, even though the person who gave birth to you was out in the fields, that person then functioned as your mother, functioned as that parent. You got the name of the person who bought your papers.
So tracing back a last name is quite often impossible. So what is it that you look for and how do you do that? And how do you know that you really belong to those people? Part of that is re-identifying or defining what those roles mean to you.
Kelly Scanlon:
You have a permanent exhibit called, With My Eyes, no Longer Blind from Langston Hughes poem. How do you choose the stories and the artifacts that best represent the African American experience in Kansas City? I know that that one's a permanent one, but you have lots of others. You say that people bring you things, but what is your criteria for that?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Well, the truth is that one was up when I got there. I had my five-year anniversary at the Black Archives a few months ago.
Kelly Scanlon:
Congratulations.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
But that exhibit was already in place. We do with our rotating and our temporary exhibits, though, people bring us those ideas. We had a group of folks from different branches of the military. They came in and said, "You know this city and this state never recognized Wiley James, PFC, Wiley James, who was killed in the war, and will you do that?" Then we realized after researching him that he grew up a few blocks from the archives. There are no pictures of him. So the drawings that we have were for someone's memory.
Then people from other branches came in. So that's how we got this little military exhibit. We also have become friends with people in the Jackson County Prosecutor's office, and the parents of Cameron Lamb wanted to know if we would house something about him. So we have the court documents. People are bringing those stories to us.
Community Remembrance, project room where we collect jars of soil from people who were lynched, innocent people who were lynched. We know some people who got lynched committed crimes, but from innocent people, and we know all of these folks as biographies. We have other people who bring us those stories, and they show us articles and newspapers where they were written about and talked about. So the news is out there. The stories are out there, and we see our role as collecting them, but we also know that because of space limitations, we have to rotate them.
Right now, we have a temporary exhibit that is Blacks in the law. Next month it will rotate to Blacks in the military.
Kelly Scanlon:
You mentioned that the rotating in and out, even the Smithsonian has to do that with the number of artifacts they have and the number of locations, they're still rotating. That makes me wonder, do you have relationships with other museums, maybe the Smithsonian or maybe some others that you work with?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
We do. We have a partnership with Smithsonian. They have sent a team of folks out several times and they visited with us and we've visited with other people and the Historic 18th and Vine District, they're going to furnish some oversized scanners because all of us, especially Negro Leagues, baseball museum and the American Jazz Museum, we have big posters, and so if we can get these scanned and they're also going to let us house all this information on their servers, then they'll be accessible around the world.
We're really, really excited about those partnerships. All of the museums in the district, we partner together, we help each other. We understand we have a common goal, which is as Bob Kendrick said, "We are the largest collection of African American life and culture in this country."
Kelly Scanlon:
You are.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
And we know that. So we want to make sure that it's always above board, that it's active, that it's exciting, and that there's something going on. The Zhou Brothers Art Center is opening up a block away.
Kelly Scanlon:
We've had them on. That's so exciting.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
It is exciting, and mutual musicians still functioning. The Boone Theater is going to be reopening pretty soon. The gym, of course is active, so we do partner with all of those. The Casey Museum, Anna Marie Tetura and her crew are doing an excellent job in telling the story of Kansas City, and we partnered with them. I helped them on committees when they were putting the museum together, so we talked about those things that are essential that we all need to preserve and we need to share.
There's a big community of art and art lovers and art historians and people who want to preserve the history in Kansas City. We are really blessed there, and so we're also proud to be a part of that. The Nelson, we go there and we take exhibits there, especially during Juneteenth and other times. So yeah, this is a big beautiful committee for sharing.
Kelly Scanlon:
It takes a lot of people to do the work that you're doing. A lot of people, a lot of organizations. We've already talked about how education plays a crucial role in the archive's mission, but can you talk to us a little bit more about how you tailor your educational programs so that you do engage diverse groups, diverse ages and backgrounds?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
One of the things is that we do at the Black Archives is recognize that we don't expect all of our teachers to know everything. So we've created some study guides, so we will give them to the teacher head of the visit, and they're turnkey. They have the history, they have tests, they have questions and answers in them and pictures so that the teachers don't have to do the work to prepare the students to come there, and that gives them a richer experience.
We've also partnered with lots of schools who bring their students there, and then we have sessions with them.
One of my favorite is we take them on a tour of the exhibits. Then they get in groups and write poems, and then they present their group poem to the entire group.
Some schools have come and their students have done video projects, and then they share those with everyone.
So we want to make sure that there's an entree into education with these visits, that it's not just a trail around and look and see if anything affects you, that we actually do some in-depth training and teaching with this.
Kelly Scanlon:
Yeah, you get them involved in the experience, like you say, rather than just looking at some plaques or pictures on the wall, yeah, that they may or may not make the connection with. By just looking at it, you actually get them engaged.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
All kinds of things come out of there. I remember these two little girls, and they stuck with me because they were so young and they had their arms around each other's shoulders. The little white girl said, "She's my best friend and nobody can tell us that we can't be friends." And I said, "Has someone been trying?" And then the little black girl said, "Well, her father doesn't really want us to be good friends." So then I got to talk to them about power structures and that, "Don't go against your father because I don't want you to be in a position where you will be hurt, but also recognize that friendship doesn't come with colors. It comes with those other things that made you like her, and it should last for a lifetime. When you get to be my age, you will remember that she was your best friend," and they were going, "Yeah, we're never going to forget each other." So there's those human dynamics that also play into the experience of the Black Archives.
Kelly Scanlon:
You've mentioned it yourself. The role of archives and museums is evolving. They have to be more interactive and some of the other things that you've mentioned, but especially in the context of social justice, of telling those stories like the Black Archives does. So how do you see the Black Archives of Mid-America contributing to these conversations? Not just in Kansas City, but beyond?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
We are a nonprofit organization and we have some restrictions on how political we can be. So what we can do and what we are doing now is we are partnering with Suburban Balance and we're going to have a voter drive so we can tell people that you need to vote, but we won't tell them who to vote for. I think that's important that everybody understands the power that they have, their individual powers. Also pre-COVID, we partnered with eight educators groups and they wanted to have a march. We did have a march from Lincoln High School, which was the Black high school down to the Black Archives, and then we had a rally and it was on education and on open education and in teaching children, young people, true history.
So we're very happy and even eager to blend with people and join them into doing these positive aspects that will promote social justice, that people see that equity is a real issue and that we need to look at it.
We need to address it and we need to be honest about it. The teachers groups all have their own T-shirts and they're like, don't you have your own Dr. Carma? I'm going like, "I can't draw stick people, but I can do words." So I created a T-shirt that said, "Revisionist History," with a line through it, "Tell the truth," and we sell it in our gift shop, and that's our motto actually, is just, just don't revise it, just tell the truth. And there's so many people out there who need the truth to be told, not just racially by gender. We partnered with KU Med Center and they have a grant project called Repair All Capital Letters, and we interview and talk to people and we're recording them about the disparities in healthcare based on race and economic conditions. So there are more things than just your day-to-Day, what you did for a living that affects your history, and we look at all of those.
Kelly Scanlon:
Looking towards the future. What are your goals and aspirations for the Black Archives of Mid-America and for you personally, what's been the most fulfilling aspect of your work?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
For the Black Archives, I want it to be self-sustaining. I spend an incredible amount of my time writing grants and hustling up money to keep it going so the paydays can be looked forward to. Everybody knows they're going to get their check. I also want it to be interactive. I want it to be a modern museum so that everybody who comes in can have a wonderful experience. We know it's stagnant and we're doing what we can now to make it interactive.
As for me, goals just keep presenting themselves to me. I had a very successful college teaching career when I left there. I went to China, had a beautiful experience teaching at Central China Normal University. I started a publishing house when I was helping people to get their books published. When I got the call to come do this, and I originally said, no, I liked working at home in my pajamas, but it's like the culmination of what I spent my teaching career doing, and I can see the history and the stories being advanced and that I can have a part in making that happen.
There's so much to be done, and we work with a lot of young people because I want them to know how to do it, and I want them to also to be able to explore their own desires and wishes and dreams, whatever it is that they feel they want to do, and we show them a road so that they can get there.
Kelly Scanlon:
How can our listeners get involved to support the important work that you're doing there at the Black Archives, whether it is attending the 50th anniversary gala that's coming up or coming to visit, or what other kinds of needs? Tell us all about that.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Well, both of those.
Kelly Scanlon:
Go visit, come to the gala.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Come visit, sign in. When I write grand proposals, they always want to know how many people come, so that's essential that I'd be able to show that the numbers are growing and more people are coming, so come. Also be a friend of the Black Archives. We have memberships. It's a nonprofit. Every dime that comes in there, we have to get from someplace, so we appreciate financial support, the emotional support, come in and tell us we're doing a good job. It's not always a walk in the park, so it's good to hear that, and it helps to make our days easier.
Sometimes we work seven-day weeks because we have a limited crew, so we appreciate that. Just spread the word, come often, bring people with you and share what you feel. If you think that we're missing something, let us know. We have a group of old folks. I need a quit calling them that, except that's the way they define themselves. Eggs and Enlightenment. They come every Friday and they don't hesitate to tell us what else they would like to see there, and that's what we want to know. It's the people's exhibit. It's a museum for Kansas, City, and for the world. So help us out.
Kelly Scanlon:
In addition to attending the museum itself, to coming to visit and perhaps supporting monetarily, are there volunteer opportunities? You mentioned that you have a very small staff. Are there ways that our listeners can help you out just from a time standpoint?
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
There are. We always need worker bees. We have, as I mentioned earlier, thousands and thousands of documents that need to be put into our system, that need to be scanned, that need to be cataloged. We need people to help us do that. We have boxes that we haven't opened yet that are filled with artifacts, so if someone could come in and help us to catalog those things, that would be wonderful. Someone could sit at the front desk and welcome visitors in, have them sign in and start them on a tour. That would be helpful. We have many, many needs for volunteers.
Kelly Scanlon:
So all kinds of ways that you can help out in your website, again, is
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Www.blackarchives.org.
Kelly Scanlon:
Black archives.org. You can see a little bit of the digital project that's out there, some wonderful pictures. I saw them earlier. They're available on your website and the opportunities that you just spoke of, and importantly, information about your 50th anniversary.
Thank you so much for coming and joining us today, and to give us an update on everything that you have going on and for continuing the work that is such an important part of our history.
Dr. Carmaletta Williams:
Thank you so much for the invitation. I appreciate you.
Joe Close:
This is Joe Close, president of Country Club bank. Thank you to Dr. Carmaletta Williams for being our Banking on KC Guest during Black History Month and during the Black Archives of Kansas City's 50th anniversary year. Country Club Bank is honored to sponsor the 50th anniversary gala and celebrate the work Dr. Carma and her team do to preserve the important history of Kansas City's Black community. Black History is a part of Kansas City's shared history. The Black Archives keeps that history alive and accessible to all. It reinforces that we are all intertwined as a community and that our opportunities are tied to our diversity. Thanks for tuning in this week we're banking on new Kansas, City Country Club Bank, member FDIC.